Since he and his brother Jacob de Rive were clearly alive to transact business in 1544 (second register of Aimé Chuard, notary at Payerne, fol. 67, dated 13 mar 1544), it follows that the mention of "the late" Claude de Rive in a document of 1538 (Pierre Chuard, notary, father of Aimé Chuard) must refer to a brother of Jean de Rive, even though the construction of this passage is otherwise ambiguous. On the other hand, it is possible that there is some other explanation, such as a scribal error, for the transaction of 1544.
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Françoise FOLA _____+
| (.... - 1463)
_Jean DE RIVE _______|
| (.... - 1505) m 1483|
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Agnelleta _____ ____
|
|
|--Claude DE RIVE
| (.... - 1544)
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaques MELLET ______|
| | (.... - 1483) |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Perronette MELLET __|
m 1483 |
| _____________________
| |
|_____________________|
|
|_____________________
She is mentioned in the terrier ACV Fm 52 several times, notably in the descriptions of the parties holding the seigneurie of the fiefs enumerated.
__
|
_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| | __
| | |
| |_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Francesia DE RIVE
|
| __
| |
| _Pierre FOLA ________|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|_Françoise FOLA _____|
(.... - 1463) |
| __
| |
|_____________________|
|
|__
Interesting information is contained in a "grosse de reconnaissances" prepared in 1774 by Nillon, from which the history of the seigneurie de Givrins was published in the Revue historique vaudoise in 1906. Nillon calls the first husband of Françoise de Rive "noble Franz Dessus l'Esel".
_Jaquetus DE RIVE _________
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ___________|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459 |
| |_Françoise FOLA ___________+
| (.... - 1463)
_George DE RIVE ________|
| (.... - 1552) m 1510 |
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN _________
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN _________|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459 |
| |_Agnelleta _____ __________
|
|
|--Françoise DE RIVE
| (.... - 1591)
| ___________________________
| |
| _Roland DE VAUMARCUS _____|
| | |
| | |___________________________
| |
|_Isabelle DE VAUMARCUS _|
m 1510 |
| _Thuring VON RINGOLTINGEN _
| |
|_Sophie VON RINGOLTINGEN _|
|
|___________________________
Two sets of parents have been suggested. The most "popular" choice seems to be Amédée de Rive and Isabelle de Compois. Before George de Rive purchased the seigneurie of Prangins, it had belonged to the de Compois family; however, if he had these parents, it seems most likely he would have inherited Prangins, and so would not have needed to buy it! The other possibility for the parentage of George is Oddet de Rive and Isabelle Bertin.
The latter parentage appears to be correct, as first suggested by Alexandre Daguet ("Essai sur Georges de Rive seigneur de Prangins, second gouverneur de Neuchâtel (1529-1552) et ses relations avec l'avoyer Faulcon (Falk) de Fribourg (1516-1519)", in Musée Neuchâtelois, 19:57-64, 100-104, 124-128, 1882), based on a letter in the de Praroman collection at the archives of Fribourg. The undated letter, evidently from the Saturday after Christmas in 1517 or 1518, is addressed from George de Ryve to Pyerre Faulcon, advoyer de Frybourg. In the context of negotiations concerning Neuchâtel, George says that he is staying with his brother Jean, evidently at Payerne: "Je fusse allez de compaygnie avecque mon frere Jehan..." He has also called Falck "mon frère", clearly an informal use of the term, but explicable if George was indeed the brother of Jean de Rive, who had married Antonia, sister of Pierre Falck. Further, if George had been staying with Jean Falck, brother of Pierre, we think it would have been more honorific and far more natural to call him "votre frere Jehan". We have not established whether Jean Falck might have been living in Payerne at that time. However, by far the most plausible solution to the relationships and parentage of George de Rive would be that he was another son of Oddet de Rive.
Daguet notes citations that place George de Rive in military service in France 1499-1500, as well as citations that he interprets as evidence of citizenship in Bern about that time. Daguet also highlights many other interesting relationships that help to explain this central figure in the history of Neuchâtel.
Immediately upon the publication of Daguet's "Essai", he received a letter from Père Gremaud, which was published in the same volume of the Musée Neuchatelois ("Appendice à la biographie de Georges de Rive deuxième gouverneur de Neuchâtel", pp. 175-176), which contains several interesting developments:
Dans le numéro de mars de cette année, page 63, j'ai cherché à expliquer les relations du second gouverneur de Neuchâtel avec le fameux Avoyer Faulcon ou Falk de Fribourg par l'origine payernoise commune de ces deux personnages. Je soupçonnais une parenté entre eux sans pouvoir l'établir positivement. Mais la lettre suivante de M. l'abbé Gremaud, le savant bibliothécaire cantonal et professeur d'histoire á Fribourg, lève tout doute à cet égard, et nous fait connaître les rapports de famille qui existaient entre les Faulcon et les De Rive. Je donne la parole à mon honorable correspondant de Fribourg :
>«J'ai lu avec intérêt votre notice sur Georges de Rive, qui contient des détails réellement nouveaux. Sur les relations de ce personnage avec les Faulcon, je puis vous donner un renseignement intéressant.
«Le 11 septembre 1525, le vicaire général (Claude Marchiandi, prieur de Rougemont) de Jean de Foresta, abbé de Payerne, donna à cens diverses terres de cette abbaye à noble Georges de Rive. L'une de ces terres est limitée ainsi : «In dominio Paterniaci... juxta terram prefati nobilis Georgii de Rippa et Jacobi de Rippa ejus nepotis quam tenet Anthonia relicta Johannis de Rippa uxor Danyelis May de Friburgo, filiaque quondam Berardi Faulcon dicti loci Friburgi in assignationem dotis.»
«Ainsi, Anthonie, fille de Bérard Faulcon (soeur de l'avoyer), avait épousé en premières noces Jean de Rive, qui, d'après le contexte, devait être frère de Georges et père de Jacques, neveu de ce dernier; autrement on ne pourrait pas expliquer ce passage. Devenue veuve, Antonie épousa Daniel May ou Meyer de Fribourg.
«La femme de Bérard Faulcon s'appelait Perroneta; son nom de famille n'est pas connu. En second noces, elle épousa cet Aymon de Torculari dont vous avez parlé dans votre notice; elle parait avec celui-ci dans un acte du 2 décembre 1482, et Aymon y est qualifié «rector scolarum Gallicorum (sic Friburgi [rector of the school of the French, or of those students who speak French, at Fribourg].»
«Votre tout dévoué
«P. Gremaud.»
A. Daguet
(The correspondent is Père Jean Gremaud 1823-1897, prolific historian and president for over 30 years of the Société d'histoire du canton de Fribourg.)
We suggest a slightly different explanation of the evidence that Daguet thought implied citizenship in Bern. The situation was that Fribourg asked Bern to exert some control over George de Rive, because he had been recruiting soldiers in the territory of Fribourg for service in France. Now, the privilege of recruiting for private mercenary regiments was supposed to be tightly controlled by the governments of the cantons. Private recruiting was nevertheless rampant, if we can judge from the frequent controversies as well as the almost constant appearance of Swiss troops on both sides of almost every conflict in Europe. But when political expediency required, the governments had to try to stop private regiments serving on the "wrong" side. For example, in 1510 we find Louis Sterner, bourgeois and Notaire-Juré of Fribourg, along with two pillars of that city, Jacob Techtermann and Hensli Vöguilli, discovered to be recruiting soldiers there for foreign adventures, in violation of the ordonnances of the city council. The guilty parties were imprisoned in the Tour Rouge, and the matter went before the council, under the presiding Avoyer, Dietrich d'Englisberg. Severe punishment was contemplated, but through the intervention of their friends, the judges were induced to be relatively indulgent. The accused were only required to pay a fine of 10 livres, with the loss of their rights of citizenship, including prohibition to be admitted to church unless they had obtained a certificate of confession and absolution. Sterner found himself without employment (his position as notary now closed to him), and so moved to Bienne, where the position of secrétaire de ville was open (Alexandre Daguet, "Ludovic Sterner, greffier à Fribourg et secrétaire de ville à Bienne (1496-1540)", in Anzeiger für Schweizerische Geschichte, 3:221-222, 248-252, 289-294, [1879-1880], a story marred by many unfortunate typographical errors later noted by Daguet himself). With this background, it is understandable that Fribourg might have objected to the activities of George de Rive.
Why would Fribourg have asked Bern to act, rather than taking legal action before the council of Fribourg? One explanation springs immediately to mind: as a result of the events of 1475, Bern and Fribourg shared control of several areas, such as Grandson, Morat, etc. They implemented joint control in a very creative way, such that the "baillif" or "Landvogt" would be chosen alternately from Bern and then from Fribourg, every five years. Other administrators would come from the other canton, assuring a balance of power. We think the problem with George de Rive must have arisen in a year when an administrator from Bern had control over an area where Fribourg thought there was a chance of influencing him. Thus, the request to Bern need not imply citizenship in Bern, and indeed, there is no mention of this family having such status in the records of Bern. Following the same line of reasoning, the problem alluded to in Fribourg's request might well have occurred in one of these "bailliages communs", rather than in the traditional territory of Fribourg, and it is entirely possible that Bern did not find his activities objectionable, since the foreign policy aims of the two cantons were not necessarily identical. This state of affairs was probably so obvious to historians in the 1880's that Daguet would not have needed to call attention to it, but the implications of the politics of that day will have faded from the consciousness of today's audience.
The three daughters of George de Rive were still alive 22 dec 1567, when it was decided that Jeanne, Françoise, and Marguerite would hold equal and joint interest in the fief of Genollier, which their father had purchased for 2,000 écus d'or 22 jun 1528 from Charles, Duc de Savoie (the history of this fief, from a "grosse de reconnaissances" of the seigneurie de Givrins, prepared by Nillion 25 nov 1774, was published under the title "La seigneurie de Givrins" in Revue historique vaudoise 14:314-316, 350-352, 317-373, in 1906). Jeanne de Rive sold her third (the part that would become the seigneurie de Givrins) 16 sep 1570 to Noble Etienne son of Pierre son of Urbain Quisard, Seigneur de Crans. The third belonging to Marguerite was acquired by Françoise, and upon her death 08 feb 1591, her two thirds of the original fief of Genollier passed to her son, Georges de Diesbach, gouverneur de Neuchâtel.
Direct proof of the parentage of George de Rive, son of Oddet de Rive and brother of Jean de Rive, has now been located, in the registers of the notary Benoît Nible of Payerne (ACV Dp 73, 1547-1582); the transaction in question is in Dp 73/1, fol. 33, dated 20 mar 1550. The former Chambrier of the old Abbey of Payerne, Jean Robert, now residing in Fribourg, had given power of attorney to Jacob Fögelly le jeune bourgeois de Fribourg to recover certain documents in his favor from the de Rive family. The documents in question, in the form of an agreement of "partage" or division, was ultimately delivered by "Noble Dame Francese fille dudict noble George de Rive relaissée de feu Noble Hans Roch de Diesbach tant comme charge expresse sus cela ayant dudict Noble George de Rive son père et à celuy nom presente et delivrante, nommement la lettre de partaige nullement viciée ne corrompue, aultresfois faict entre Jehan et George de Rive filz de feu Oddet de Rive bourgeois de Paierne d'une part, et Pierre Rebur ? tant comme administrateur de Jehan, Stevenin, et Glauda ses enfans et de feu Marguerite sa femme fille dudict feu Oddet de Rive d'aultre part, receue et signée par feu Discret Pierre Morens notaire dudict Paierne soubz la date de vingt et quattrieme jour du mois d'octobre de l'an courant mille quattre centz novante six". The earlier notary was probably Pierre Moron fils, but his surviving register jumps from 1495 to 1498. Thus the original partage seems to have been lost.
_____________________
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| |_____________________
|
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| | _Pierre FOLA ________
| | |
| |_Françoise FOLA _____|
| (.... - 1463) |
| |_____________________
|
|
|--George DE RIVE
| (.... - 1552)
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___|
| | |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
(.... - 1492) m 1459|
| _____________________
| |
|_Agnelleta _____ ____|
|
|_____________________
__
|
_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| | __
| | |
| |_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Guillermus DE RIVE
|
| __
| |
| _Pierre FOLA ________|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|_Françoise FOLA _____|
(.... - 1463) |
| __
| |
|_____________________|
|
|__
Mentioned frequently in documents at Payerne in the early 16th Century. Among them is a document in Latin that was sewn into the third register of the notary Pierre Chuard (ACV DP 16/3, after fol. 128). The document is dated 26 sep 1538, and appears to be in the hand of Pierre Chuard, even though his other documents of this period are almost entirely in French (sometimes with a few words of Latin interspersed). The document concerns a sale of property of the de Rive family to François, son of Daniel Meyer of Fribourg. (With apologies for Latin abbreviations and word endings undoubtedly misinterpreted!)
"Providus vir Jacobus filius quondam Johannis de Rippa et heres universalis quondam Claudii de Rippa sui fratris burgensis Paterniaci tanquam sciens etc., vendit perpetue et irrevocabiliter pro se et suis etc., honesto viro Francisco filio providi viri Danyelis Mehier burgensis friburgi presenti etc., pro se et suis etc., videlicet unam seyturatam prati sitam in fenagio et dominio (?) dicti Paterniaci loco dicto eys praz danum (?) juxta terram camporum de champagnye ex occidente, clausum Oddeti et Johannis Vouchis ex oriente, Et affrontum super pratum deys Crostel a borea et supra terram Guillierum Crostel a vento, cum suis fonds, fructibus et portionem (?) universis. Item magis, vendit prout super unum Rachetum sue unam litteram Reacheti alias per honestam mulierem Anthoniam filiam quondam Berardi Faulcon relictam dicti quondam Johannis de Rippa nunc uxor dicti Danyelis Mehier et matrem dicti Francesci emptoris largitam et concessam dictis quondam Claudio de Rippa et Jacobo de Rippa venditori de possessionibus bustis, Et primo de duabus posas terre situs in territorio Paterniaci loco dicto in condemyna fori juxtam terram Georgii de Rippa ab oriente terram confratrie sancti spiritus paterniaci ab occidente Et affrontam super terram Petri Dodin a borea terram Claudii Crostel et Claudii Fywaz a vento. Item, de duabus posas situs ibidem prope juxta terram dictorum Claudii et Jacobi de Rippa fratrum ab oriente terram dictorum Claudii Crostel et Claudii Fywaz ab occidente Et affrontum supra plures contors a borea a vento. Item, de terra parte unius morcelli terre contenentem septem posas terre situs in eodem territorio loco dicto in condemina de Plagnyou juxta terram dominorum conventus paterniaci a borea terram Claudii Michie junioris ab oriente et supra plures contors ab occidente cum eorum fondis et pertinences constante (?) lictera ipsus Reacheti hys presentibus annexa per quondam discretum virum Franciscum Rueracti clericum paterniaci recepta et per notarium sub signatum ex commissione signata data die decima mensis septembris anno domino millessimo quingesimo sexto sub sigillo communitatis ville paterniaci sigillanda. Et hoc venditit .... precio .... et ... ducentorum florens sabaudie ppond. valorem quolibet florens eorumdem duodecim solidis lausannensis bonorum per se dictum Jacobum de Rippa venditorem a dicto Francisco Mehier emptorum habitorum et receptorum etc., ultra precium in eodem lictera reacheti contentus et tunc jam receptum etc., Devestiendo se idem Jacobus de Rippa venditor presente et suis etc., de dictis seyturata prati et lictera racheti et portionibus (?) prefatum Franciscum Mehier emptorem et suis etc., de eisdem corporaliter et actualiter investiendo per presentes nichil juris actionis per prietaix etc., tituli in eisdem retiendo etc., Et in signum dicte vere venditionis dicti reacheti et possessiono in eodem limitatus et descriptis tradidi et expedius dictam licteram racheti sanam et integram per dicto Francisco Mehier emptorum .... que de ipsa uti gaudere et ne (?) jubare potuissent ante confessionem presentis instrumenti, Promictens in super ipse Jacobus de Rippa venditor per se et suis etc., bona fide sua etc., et sub obligatione omnium bonorum suorum quorumcumque premissa omnia per me superius vendita et expressa cum eorum fonds et pertincenem, Eidem Francisco Mehier emptori et suis etc. perpetue mannere deffendere pacifere (?) que et quiete guerence... ab omnibus et contra omnes et verbusque etc. suis et suorum propriis missionibus et expen... e... omnis dampnorum restitutione .... etc. Saluvis tan.. in permissis venditus erusibus directis annualiter pro prelimitatis seyturata et possessionibus in eodem reacheto contentum debitis per dictum Franciscum Mehier emptorem et suos etc. ex nunc et perpetue supportandus acque solvendus domo sue d... a quo ut a quibus nomine sue debere reperientur, remictans signis ipse Jacobus venditor omnibus exceptione alleg..bus etc. Jorans ut super predicta omnia rata et rata ... ... nenumque alteri de super de signato reacheto fecisse venditorem sue allienationem contra que perdicta non facem etc. vene fiat cum clausis opportunatus datum paterniaci die vigesima sexta mensis septembris anno domino millesimo quingesimo trigesimo octavo.
"Constati michi notarum de laivatione supra facta datus ut super.
"Supra nominatus Franciscus Mehier burgensis friburgi consti se devere et sol... .teneri present etc. predicto Jacobo de Rippa presente pro se etc. videlicet quinquaginta florenos sabaudie valoris quorum super causa reste acquisicionis super proxime scripte etc. sol...dem bona fide sua etc. et sub obligationem omnium suorum bonorum etc. eidus creditus ut suis ... huic ad proximum festum sancti martini yemalis cum dampnis r.... fiat cum clausis opportunus datum die et anno supra scriptis."
After his death, a particularly confusing document dated 03 jun 1552, recorded by Blaise Chalon, notary at Payerne, and related to the Gachet family, mentions as a party to a settlement among the heirs of Pierre Chevrod, a group of daughters and sons of the late Jean Trolliet and the late Marie de Rive. The unnamed daughters, represented by one Jean Huguet of Romont, who had bought out their shares from their respective husbands Bernard Papet, Pierre Faisant, and Maurice Filieux, had inherited from the estate of Jacob de Rive. Other documents from the same notary identify the daughters as Bernardine, wife of Bernard Papet, cordonnier of Romont; Ysabel, wife of Pierre Fazan, notary of Apples; Claudaz, wife of Maurice Fillioux, serrurier of Romont; and Peronnette, wife of Jean Huguet, chappuis of Romont. How the estate of Pierre Chevrod and that of Jacob de Rive may be connected has not been worked out.
Another document recorded by Aimé Chuard, 31 dec 1546, involves Pierre Chuard acting for the same heirs of the late Jean Trolliet, his uncle, as heirs of the late Jacob de Rive. Jacob was still alive in 1543, when he is cited as a member of the council of Payerne.
Noble Jacob de Rive acknowleged on 04 jan 1542 that he and his heirs were liable for an annual rent of 12 sols for a property pledged to the convent of Payerne by Claude de Rippa on 12 jul 1450 for a loan of 12 livres. This Claudius de Rippa had a brother Jacobus de Rippa, but exactly how the debt came to be inherited by Jacob de Rive is not specified. Presumably the line of Claudius and Jacobus had died out, and the obligation was thus passed at some point to the ancestors of Jacob de Rive.
There is also an intriguing document in the registers of the notary Aymé Chuard of Payerne (ACV Dp 15/2, fol. 344v, dated 30 nov 1544, in which property from the estate of the late Jacob de Rive is sold to Nicod de Trey. The inheritance from Jacob by this time had fallen 1/8 to Anne daughter of Jean Michiez, wife of the minister Daniel Demont, and 7/8 to the children of Jean Troilliet of Romont by his late wife Marie, daughter of Jean de Rive and his wife Pernette. The division reported here implies that Anne and the Troilliet children (seven of them are known) must all have been grandchildren of Jean de Rive, and therefore that the wife of Jean Michiez must also have been from the de Rive family. Or, conceivably, perhaps Marie de Rive herself had previously been married to Jean Michiez.
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Françoise FOLA _____+
| (.... - 1463)
_Jean DE RIVE _______|
| (.... - 1505) m 1483|
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Agnelleta _____ ____
|
|
|--Jacob DE RIVE
| (.... - 1546)
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaques MELLET ______|
| | (.... - 1483) |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Perronette MELLET __|
m 1483 |
| _____________________
| |
|_____________________|
|
|_____________________
Two different wives are mentioned in documents from Payerne. The chronology is uncertain, as are the children to be attributed to each wife. He is already deceased by 02 jan 1442, when his unnamed heirs are mentioned as adjacent landholders in a "reconnaissance" for property subject to the Abbey of Payerne (ACV Aa 12/3bis, no. 530).
On 11 feb 1463 (AEF Reg. Not. 54, fol. 459), Odet de Ripa, acting for his sister Nicoleta, daughter of Jaquetus de Ripa and the late Francesia Fola, sold property at Favargny, held jointly with Catharine and Agnes, sisters of Francesia. Catherine was the wife of Stephanus or Etienne Cléron.
Still alive in 1503, when he appears to be listed as Lieutenant Avoyer of Payerne, in the surviving register of Pierre Ruerat, notary at Payerne, 11 apr 1503. The same documents lists various citizens and officials of Payerne, including George de Rive, no relationship indicated, as well as many other familiar names. The genealogies compiled by Hubert de Vevey mention a sale (AEF Reg. Not. 111 fol. 20v, 1505) by Louis Davrye (=d'Affry) to Hans Faulcon acting for his sister Anthonia, widow of the late Johannes de Riva (not yet examined).
[14598] Date of contract, recorded by Pierre Moron père, notary at Payerne.
[14597] Date of marriage settlement, Jean de Ripa received from Jean Faucon of Fribourg and his brother Pierre Faucon, 400 fl. for marriage to their sister Anthonia daughter of the late Berard Faucon, Pierre Ruchat, notary p. 33.
_____________________
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| |_____________________
|
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| | _Pierre FOLA ________
| | |
| |_Françoise FOLA _____|
| (.... - 1463) |
| |_____________________
|
|
|--Jean DE RIVE
| (.... - 1505)
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___|
| | |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
(.... - 1492) m 1459|
| _____________________
| |
|_Agnelleta _____ ____|
|
|_____________________
_Jaquetus DE RIVE _________
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ___________|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459 |
| |_Françoise FOLA ___________+
| (.... - 1463)
_George DE RIVE ________|
| (.... - 1552) m 1510 |
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN _________
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN _________|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459 |
| |_Agnelleta _____ __________
|
|
|--Jeanne DE RIVE
| (.... - 1570)
| ___________________________
| |
| _Roland DE VAUMARCUS _____|
| | |
| | |___________________________
| |
|_Isabelle DE VAUMARCUS _|
m 1510 |
| _Thuring VON RINGOLTINGEN _
| |
|_Sophie VON RINGOLTINGEN _|
|
|___________________________
__
|
_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| | __
| | |
| |_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Margareta DE RIVE
|
| __
| |
| _Pierre FOLA ________|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|_Françoise FOLA _____|
(.... - 1463) |
| __
| |
|_____________________|
|
|__
_____________________
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| |_____________________
|
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| | _Pierre FOLA ________
| | |
| |_Françoise FOLA _____|
| (.... - 1463) |
| |_____________________
|
|
|--Marguerite DE RIVE
|
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___|
| | |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
(.... - 1492) m 1459|
| _____________________
| |
|_Agnelleta _____ ____|
|
|_____________________
Her first two husbands are mentioned by a number of historians. Her third marriage seems to have escaped notice. It is noted in the registers of Abraham Chuard, notary at Payerne, 12 jun 1562 (ACV DP 14).
_Jaquetus DE RIVE _________
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ___________|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459 |
| |_Françoise FOLA ___________+
| (.... - 1463)
_George DE RIVE ________|
| (.... - 1552) m 1510 |
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN _________
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN _________|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459 |
| |_Agnelleta _____ __________
|
|
|--Marguerite DE RIVE
| (.... - 1567)
| ___________________________
| |
| _Roland DE VAUMARCUS _____|
| | |
| | |___________________________
| |
|_Isabelle DE VAUMARCUS _|
m 1510 |
| _Thuring VON RINGOLTINGEN _
| |
|_Sophie VON RINGOLTINGEN _|
|
|___________________________
Jacob de Rive is described as her "frère paternel", implying that her mother was not the mother of Jacob. It is possible that Jean de Rive had another wife. Her daughters had also inherited, apparently, from Pierre Chevrod, but exactly how is not known.
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Françoise FOLA _____+
| (.... - 1463)
_Jean DE RIVE _______|
| (.... - 1505) m 1483|
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Agnelleta _____ ____
|
|
|--Marie DE RIVE
| (.... - 1544)
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaques MELLET ______|
| | (.... - 1483) |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Perronette MELLET __|
m 1483 |
| _____________________
| |
|_____________________|
|
|_____________________
__
|
_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| | __
| | |
| |_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Nicoleta DE RIVE
|
| __
| |
| _Pierre FOLA ________|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|_Françoise FOLA _____|
(.... - 1463) |
| __
| |
|_____________________|
|
|__
Syndic of Payerne, 1458. He is the son of Jaquetus or Jacobus de Rippa who made his testament in 1431 at Payerne. This is proved further by a document of Jean Bellin, notary at Payerne (ACV DP 8, fol. 90, 02 jul 1451), in which Marguereta, daughter of the late Jaqueti de Rippa and his late wife Margareta (her name possibly added later, very faint), and widow of the late Vualcherus Cordeir, cedes property to her brother Oddeti. It is now clear that Oddet was the father of Georges de Rive. Jaquetus was conseiller de Payerne as early as 1408. Oddet is noted as Lieutenant of the Avoyer at Payerne, 1481-1486. (At that period, the Avoyer, appointed by the ruler of Savoie, was usually not resident at Payerne, he simply collected the receipts; the position of Lieutenant d'Avoyer was the actual administrator. After the Bernese conquest, the position of Avoyer became the actual administrator, now appointed by Bern.)
The relationships of this family resulted in a small terrier (ACV Fm 52) containing reconnaissances with dates ranging from 1437 to 1500 (mostly about 1451) concerning property over which various of their ancestors held seigneurie. The preambles of many of the reconnaissances in this volume give genealogical details.
Oddetus de Rippa is named as an adjacent landholder in a "reconnaissance" dated 26 sep 1422, for property subject to the Abbey of Payerne (ACV Aa 12/4, no. 588), which suggests he may have been born as early as 1397, in order to hold property in his own name in 1422.
__
|
_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___|
| (.... - 1432) |
| | __
| | |
| |_____________________|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Oddet DE RIVE
| (1400 - 1492)
| __
| |
| _Pierre FOLA ________|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|_Françoise FOLA _____|
(.... - 1463) |
| __
| |
|_____________________|
|
|__
_Jaquetus DE RIVE ___
| (.... - 1432)
_Oddet DE RIVE ______|
| (1400 - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Françoise FOLA _____+
| (.... - 1463)
_Jean DE RIVE _______|
| (.... - 1505) m 1483|
| | _Jaquetus BERTHIN ___
| | |
| |_Isabelle BERTIN ____|
| (.... - 1492) m 1459|
| |_Agnelleta _____ ____
|
|
|--(daughter) DE RIVE?
|
| _____________________
| |
| _Jaques MELLET ______|
| | (.... - 1483) |
| | |_____________________
| |
|_Perronette MELLET __|
m 1483 |
| _____________________
| |
|_____________________|
|
|_____________________
__
|
_Jean DE SAINT-AMOUR _|
| |
| |__
|
_Pierre DE SAINT-AMOUR _|
| (.... - 1477) |
| | __
| | |
| |______________________|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Jacob DE SAINT-AMOUR
| (.... - 1477)
| __
| |
| ______________________|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|_Pernette _____ ________|
(.... - 1477) |
| __
| |
|______________________|
|
|__
Seigneur de Vincelles en la Bresse, Chalonnoise, & de Chasteauvillain en Comté & de Guygonne en Corgenon, according to Samuel Guichenon, 1650, Histoire de Bresse et de Bugey (Lyon, Jean Antoine Huguetan & Marc Antoine Ravaud), troisième partie, pp. 249-258, containing the genealogy of the de Menthon family.
The catalogue of the ACV identifies two isolated documents from this family (ACV C XVI 237/1 and 2), dated 1477 and 1496. These prove to be the testament of Petrus de Sancto-Amore and a transaction by Johannes de Torculari and his wife Peronneta, daughter of Petrus de Sancto-Amore, relating to her father's bequest to the priory of Lutry.
While the present Jean de Saint-Amour is generally supposed to have been the father both of Marie, who married Henri de Menthon, and of Pierre, whose daughter married Johannes de Torculari, it is very possible that a generation has been missed, and that Pierre and his brother Jean (mentioned in Pierre's testament of 1477) are actually the grandchildren of the present Jean de Saint-Amour.
__
|
__|
| |
| |__
|
_Jean DE SAINT-AMOUR _|
| |
| | __
| | |
| |__|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Jean DE SAINT-AMOUR
| (.... - 1477)
| __
| |
| __|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|______________________|
|
| __
| |
|__|
|
|__
__
|
__|
| |
| |__
|
_Jean DE SAINT-AMOUR _|
| |
| | __
| | |
| |__|
| |
| |__
|
|
|--Marie DE SAINT-AMOUR
|
| __
| |
| __|
| | |
| | |__
| |
|______________________|
|
| __
| |
|__|
|
|__